I don't have work for the next month. My non-dinosaur of a computer died a few days ago and is currently in for repairs and the one I'm currently using doesn't even meet the specs to play FF. Nothing is really happening IRL for another week. So I'm going to try to think of this as an opportunity and finish yet another task on my
checklist of things I'd like to contribute or figure out.
To get an idea of how lazy I am, I basically finished this a long time ago--like over 6 months ago. I just never got around to doing some final tweaks before posting it.
Looking over it, I'd made a few small errors and inconsistencies (now fixed). Some things have also changed since then. For example, it's now commonly believed that Homam Corazza gives +1% triple attack rather than +2.5% (a disappointment, if it is indeed true). Also, Mirke Wardecors (with 10acc and 3% D.W.) are thusly believed to be superior to Corazza for Thf tp-gain. In the thief portion of this, I used Homam under the 2.5% assumption, but rest assured that the values shown are actually very close to what they would be if I'd used the Mirke Wardecors ACP body for the calculations instead. If you're going to be using Corazza (/war or otherwise), the tp fed will be lower than shown.
( How does this comparison work? (Formula, etc) )Notes-StoreTP irrelevant; only BaseTP used for enemy's TP-Gain.
-w/ TestDelayPeriod of 3600, this gives ->
TpGiven/Hit * #Hits/Minute = TpGiven/Minute
Settings-Haste Spell + Victory March = +26% haste
-TestDelayPeriod (this # is arbitrary) = 1 real minute = 3600
-Significant Figures taken for each calc (arbitrary-ish) = 5
-TpGiven/Hit Truncated to 1st decimal after SubtleBlow. I think this is correct.</div>
Cross-ComparisonThief/Nin( Read more... )TpGiven/Minute: (4.5 + 3)*(1 - 0.15) * (3600 / 73)*1.3 = 7.5*0.85 * 49.315*1.3 = 6.3*64.110 =
403.89Thief/War( Read more... )TpGiven/Minute: (4.9 + 3)*(1 - 0.05) * (3600 / 99)*1.4 = 7.9 * 36.364*1.4 = 7.9*50.909 =
382.07Monk/Nin( Read more... )TpGiven/Minute: (4.5 + 3)*(1 - 0.3) * (3600 / 90)*1.2 = 7.5*0.75 * 40*1.2 = 5.6*48 =
252.00Ninja/War( Read more... )TpGiven/Minute: (4.6 + 3)*(1 - 0.35) * (3600 / 72)*1.15 = 7.6*0.7 * 50*1.15 = 5.3*57.5 =
284.05Samurai/War( Read more... )TpGiven/Minute: (11.5 + 3)*(1 - 0.05) * (3600 / 247)*1.17 = 14.5*0.95 * 14.575*1.17 = 13.7*17.053 =
233.62Thief/Nin (Corazza -> DH, etc)
( Read more... )TpGiven/Minute(NQ): 7.5*(1 - 0.4) * (3600 / 82)*1.25 = 7.5*0.6 * 43.902*1.25 = 4.5*54.878 =
246.95TpGiven/Minute(HQ): 7.5*(1 - 0.43) * (3600 / 82)*1.25 = 7.5*0.57 * 43.902*1.25 = 4.2*54.878 =
230.49*Estimated*50%SB Build: less than 7.5*(1 - 0.5) * (3600 / 82)*1.25 =
less than 205.79Conclusions and Marginal DifferencesUsing standard melee sets, we can make some comparisons. Of course, the comparisons are not so valid if the melee sets aren't these exact sets, or if the haste gained from spells is different. Using these sets and these settings, though, we get the following ratios for comparing these three melee classes and the tp they give to mobs:
Those Bloody Eastern Melee Jobs-Mnk/Nin gives a base of 252.00 tp/minute to the mob
-Nin/War gives ~12.7% more tp/time than the mnk
-Sam/War gives ~7.3% less tp/time than the mnk
Thief in a Traditional DD Build-Thf/Nin gives ~60.3% more tp/time than the mnk (lolololol)
-Thf/Nin gives about ~5.7% more tp/time than Thf/War
Thief, in Subtle Blow Builds-Thf/Nin in DH gives ~37.0% more tp/time (big difference)
-Thf/Nin in a heavy, but inexpensive(NQ) 3-piece-extra Subtle Blow set gives ~2.0% less tp/time
-Thf/Nin in an even heavier SB build (and still 7 SB away from the cap) gives ~8.5% less than the Mnk, and 1.3% less than the Sam
-Thf/Nin in a capped SB build would give over 18.3% less tp/time than the Mnk and 11.9% less than the Sam
I started this particular project simply because I was interested in knowing just how much TP I was giving mobs in comparison to other melee. Also I wanted to know how much of an effect subtle blow builds were having on my Thf, as knowledge to help me as both a soloer and as a tank.
I wasn't particularly concerned about showing this to anyone else, but I do know that this information may be of interest as some and can certainly be of use to thieves in particular. It's good to know that the stigma that thieves are tp-feeding machines is true and to avoid stubornness and quantify the difference. 2 Thieves will feed a little more TP to a mob than 3 Mnks, in standard gear. Fair enough.
But it also helps to see just how much of an effect the subtle blow has. It is easily possible for us to feed less TP/time than other melee by using the wide variety of equipment we have available. Our
dragon JSE is a godsend for this. Also, unlike Mnks, we can equip
Peiste Belt +1, which is a godsend and I would highly recommend it to anyone who takes their Thf seriously. Of course, other melee can stack up on subtle blow as well, and this is encouraged if they so desire it.
I'd recommend at least making two new equipment sets if you don't have them already:
(1) DD Set - Subtle Blow

(2) Solo/Tanking Set - Subtle Blow

The DD set should simply be your traditional TP set, with the only differences being pieces that have heavy SB on them. A good example of swaps to change are: dragon harness, peiste belt +1, rajas (should already be on), dragon/enkidu's subligar. The same goes for your solo or tanking set(s). Keep it just as is (evasion or whatever else you use), but use the previous equips as well. If you want to stack up closer to the subtle blow cap (50%), adding dragon cap or dragon mittens is just fine. The more HQ the better on these, for sure, as the NQ's are pretty terrible to melee in otherwise.
Failnaught is also an (expensive) option. The new
Fane Baselard is also a very interesting option as well. We've been seeing some very interesting things on the forums with this new dagger (
Allah',
KI).
The difference in the TP you give to mobs is huge. With a dedicated build, you'll notice the difference immediately. And you'll be that much better of a DD and a, if pimp enough, tank.
Crit Rate :: Man/Rid vs GA/Nin vs Swords :: 日本物(Japanese Stuff) :: How to Maximize SA/TA
How much TP do DD's feed? :: How to Stack Defense-Down
Garden Relic Funding :: Thief Builds :: Mandau Facts :: TH Testing :: Videos